Media Alexander Volkanovski’s Acting Debut.

[StonedLemur]

0-4 vs the other FW champs, knocked out by two of them 3 times and 30-27d by the other - all happening when he was 32 or younger - and people still call him the GOAT.

Now that is downright hilarious.

Still 4 defenses in front sir.

 

[Larzon]

Still 4 defenses in front sir.

So raw numbers are all you go off?

 

[Dr Fong]

Still 4 defenses in front sir.

Aldo has won 7 championship fights, 1 interim in the UFC (later promoted). Volk 6 championship fights wins. A win over Topuria puts Volk at the same number of full title fight wins. And Volk is undefeated at FW.

And regardless, there is no rational reason why beating a few other random people somehow negates the fact that when Aldo fought the 3 other champs of his division, he didn't just get beaten, he got curb stomped and completely outclassed. When he was still young.

Aldo was one of my favorite fighters. I actually want Aldo to be the GOAT. But one sad day when I was a child, I realised that reality does not care about what I want. I am sorry that one day you may have to face this yourself.

 

[Dr Fong]

So raw numbers are all you go off?

You want to know another hilarious number? Not only is Aldo 0-4 vs Volk/Max/Conor but Aldo's common opponent record against them is 0-7 (obviously not including when they fought each other).

His deluded fanboys act as if Aldo beating these other random guys should somehow negate him getting obliterated by the 3 other champs, when his best wins also got beaten by them too.

A combined 0-11 record for Aldo himself and Aldo's opponents against the 3 other champs. Not only has Aldo never beaten them, he has never even beaten anyone who has ever beaten them.

And people argue with a straight face that he is the GOAT. Just completely embarrassing.

 

[Larzon]

You want to know another hilarious number? Not only is Aldo 0-4 vs Volk/Max/Conor but Aldo's common opponent record against them is 0-7 (obviously not including when they fought each other).

His deluded fanboys act as if Aldo beating these other random guys should somehow negate him getting obliterated by the 3 other champs, when his best wins also got beaten by them too.

A combined 0-11 record for Aldo himself and Aldo's opponents against the 3 other champs. Not only has Aldo never beaten them, he has never even beaten anyone who has ever beaten them.

And people argue with a straight face that he is the GOAT. Just completely embarrassing.

I didn't know that. Pretty interesting stats

 

[oldschoolmmafan]

Still better than McGregor in Roadhouse.

He deserves an Oscar compared to Mcgregor.

 

[Dr Fong]

I didn't know that. Pretty interesting stats

I'll make a thread about it after the Volk fight when all the Aldo fanboys - often in the media - come out of the woodwork.

It makes the argument that he is the GOAT literally impossible to defend. But weirdos will still try.

 

[fortheo]

Yeah, Aldo is pretty funny sometimes.

Still 4 defenses in front sir.

I have aldo ahead, but something that people don't talk about much when having this conversation is the fact that Aldo lost 5 times at FW and Volk is undefeated at FW. I think Aldo is far enough ahead (I count WEC) where I can bypass his losses and still give him the nod, but if volk gets within a couple defenses of Aldo's record while never losing at FW and holding a win over Aldo, the argument is going to be a lot more convoluted.

As of right now though, Aldo has the goat resume at FW for me.

 

[fortheo]

You want to know another hilarious number? Not only is Aldo 0-4 vs Volk/Max/Conor but Aldo's common opponent record against them is 0-7 (obviously not including when they fought each other).

His deluded fanboys act as if Aldo beating these other random guys should somehow negate him getting obliterated by the 3 other champs, when his best wins also got beaten by them too.

A combined 0-11 record for Aldo himself and Aldo's opponents against the 3 other champs. Not only has Aldo never beaten them, he has never even beaten anyone who has ever beaten them.

And people argue with a straight face that he is the GOAT. Just completely embarrassing.

In a sport where an athlete's peak is generally only a few years, what you're talking about (and wrongly holding against Aldo) is actually just the the normal divisional turn over rate, and it happens in all divisions. For example, None of the guys Max beat did well against volk, none of the guys Anderson silva beat did particularly well against future Middle weight champs, none of the guys Usman beat have done well (or are likely to do well) against Leon and other future WW champs etc etc etc.

It's because the champs beat their opponents when their opponents are at their absolute peak, then the future champs catch those same guys a bit later, when those guys are the previous champ's left overs, when they're on the downside of their peak/career.

In Aldo's case, his best wins were happening from 2009-2014. Aldo, as the champ, was facing and beating his opponents while they were at their absolute peak, whereas Max and volk fought aldo's left over opponents (KZ, Mendes, Edgar etc), later, as they were down sliding out of the peak of their careers.

 

[Dr Fong]

In a sport where an athlete's peak is generally only a few years, what you're talking about (and wrongly holding against Aldo) is actually just the the normal divisional turn over rate and it happens in all divisions, especially in ones that had long reigning champs -- for example, None of the guys Max beat did well against volk, none of the guys anderson silva beat did particularly well against future Middle weight champs, none of the guys Usman beat have done well (or are likely to do well) against Leon and other future WW champs etc etc etc.

Aldo's best wins were happening from 2009-2014. Aldo, as the champ, was facing and beating his opponents while they were at their absolute peak, whereas Max and volk fought aldo's left over opponents, often years later, as they were down sliding out of the peak of their careers. It makes sense that none of those guys Aldo beat would do well in the twilight of their careers against newer, fresher blood. That is the normal turn over that happens in this sport.

Extreme amounts of delusional cope.

Aldo was between 29-32 when he got dismantled by Conor, Max and Volk. The prime fighting years of MMA fighters.

He still had good runs between them. He regained the championship in between losing to Conor and Max, he destroyed Moicano and Stephens in between losing to Max and Volk, and he had a good run at BW after losing to Volk, fighting for the belt and beating top guys.

He wasn't finished at all.

He just wasn't good enough to beat the 3 other FW champs or even come close to beating them. Nor was anybody he ever beat good enough to beat them. Great fighter, but this record is so disgraceful that it makes a genuine fool of anyone who maintains this delusion.

 

[fortheo]

Extreme amounts of delusional cope.

Aldo was between 29-32 when he got dismantled by Conor, Max and Volk. The prime fighting years of MMA fighters.

He still had good runs between them. He regained the championship in between losing to Conor and Max, he destroyed Moicano and Stephens in between losing to Max and Volk, and he had a good run at BW after losing to Volk, fighting for the belt and beating top guys.

He wasn't finished at all.

He just wasn't good enough to beat the 3 other FW champs or even come close to beating them. Nor was anybody he ever beat good enough to beat them. Great fighter, but this record is so disgraceful that it makes a genuine fool of anyone who maintains this delusion.

Nothing you said disproves my point or even addresses it as I never spoke about fighters' ages. What you criticize Aldo for applies to many divisions, and even to max and volk themselves -- it is the normal divisional turnover rate, and not something to hold against fighters when analyzing their careers in hindsight.

Faber's comp didn't do well against Aldo, the same way Aldo's comp didn't do good against Max, the same way Max's comp didn't do well against volk, the same way Woodley's comp didn't do good against usman and usman's comp isnt doing good against leon etc etc etc. That is the way divisions progress and turn over.

Also, considering volkanovski is my favorite fighter, I have nothing to cope with here in defending Aldo.

 

[Dr Fong]

You're conflating age with a fighters peak. They arent the same, and considering volkanovski is my favorite fighter, I have nothing to cope with here.

Nothing you said disproves my point. What you said applies to many divisions -- it is the normal divisional turnover rate.

I am not. I showed you why the whole post-prime Aldo argument is bullshit. Aldo did not fall off a cliff. He was still an elite fighter after losing to all 3 guys. Did you see his second fight with Frankie after losing to Conor? He tooled him. He looked great.

Did you see his fights with Moicano and Stephens after he got beat 2x by Max and before he got dismantled by Volk? Absolutely crushed them.

When a guy collapses at age 29, you could make the argument that the fight game caught up wIth them. But this didn't happen with Aldo. He just ran into 3 guys that were clearly better than him.

There is no doubt that Aldo's kicking game suffered from his early days. But it had suffered long before he lost to Conor. And he got much better at other aspects of MMA to compensate. He was still evolving as a fighter even when he genuinely did fall out of his prime later in BW.

 

[fortheo]

I am not. I showed you why the whole post-prime Aldo argument is bullshit. Aldo did not fall off a cliff. He was still an elite fighter after losing to all 3 guys. Did you see his second fight with Frankie after losing to Conor? He tooled him. He looked great.

Did you see his fights with Moicano and Stephens after he got beat 2x by Max and before he got dismantled by Volk? Absolutely crushed them.

When a guy collapses at age 29, you could make the argument that the fight game caught up wIth them. But this didn't happen with Aldo. He just ran into 3 guys that were clearly better than him.

There is no doubt that Aldo's kicking game suffered from his early days. But it had suffered long before he lost to Conor. And he got much better at other aspects of MMA to compensate. He was still evolving as a fighter even when he genuinely did fall out of his prime later in BW.

When did I mention post prime aldo? You're missing my argument completely.

 

[Dr Fong]

When did I mention post prime aldo? You're missing my argument completely.

'You're conflating age with a fighters peak'

You're right, I did misunderstand your agrument because I assumed you were also talking about Aldo himself, not just his 'peak' opponents.

My brain seemed to apply that to you because your argument focuses only on the secondary and far less important argument I initially made.

Think of the 0-7 common opponent record as the bonus round. The 0-4 straight up record vs Volk/Max/Conor is still the main part where Aldo's claim to GOAT status becomes ridiculous. You can nitpick who was or wasn't still at their 'peak' of the 0-7 it doesn't change anything.

 

[fortheo]

'You're conflating age with a fighters peak'

You're right, I did misunderstand your agrument because I assumed you were also talking about Aldo himself, not just his 'peak' opponents.

My brain seemed to apply that to you because your argument focuses only on the secondary and far less important argument I initially made.

Think of the 0-7 common opponent record as the bonus round. The 0-4 straight up record vs Volk/Max/Conor is still the main part where Aldo's claim to GOAT status becomes ridiculous. You can nitpick who was or wasn't still at their 'peak' of the 0-7 it doesn't change anything.

Well your bonus "hilarious stat" is so common that it's not even noteworthy, especially when it also applies to the other fighters you're putting over Aldo. That's all I was saying.

 

[Dr Fong]

Well your bonus "hilarious stat" is so common that it's not even noteworthy, especially when it also applies to the other fighters you're putting over Aldo. That's all I was saying.

It's only 'hilarious' in the context of calling Aldo the GOAT, which for Aldo fanboys relies solely on 'title defense' stats. So this horrible stat is used to counter it.

And it is noteworthy. Find me another stat like the 0-7, let alone the 0-4 direct record in a division where GOAT is contested. The real point is not the stat itself, but to undermine the argument that Aldo's 0-4 record vs Conor/Max/Volk can be counteracted by strength of schedule.

Sure Edgar wasn't in his prime vs Max. But Mendes was perfectly in his prime vs Conor. Of course he was on short-notice, but now we are actually looking at actual context. And the real context of Hominick, Kenflo, Lamas, an injury-derailed TKZ were that these were not amazing wins.

Aldo 'GOAT' people rely on us not to actually consider how elite these wins were, but rather just to add them to the defence stat without thinking about it.

But they can't have it both ways. If the title defence stat is meaningful, then so of course is his horrible record against other champs and the horrible record of his competition vs these other champs. Aldo's record against his very best competition is frankly embarrassing.

 

[Larzon]

Just a funny humble bloke.

 

[barillas]

How not to love Volk? funny as hell

 

[barillas]

It's only 'hilarious' in the context of calling Aldo the GOAT, which for Aldo fanboys relies solely on 'title defense' stats. So this horrible stat is used to counter it.

And it is noteworthy. Find me another stat like the 0-7, let alone the 0-4 direct record in a division where GOAT is contested. The real point is not the stat itself, but to undermine the argument that Aldo's 0-4 record vs Conor/Max/Volk can be counteracted by strength of schedule.

Sure Edgar wasn't in his prime vs Max. But Mendes was perfectly in his prime vs Conor. Of course he was on short-notice, but now we are actually looking at actual context. And the real context of Hominick, Kenflo, Lamas, an injury-derailed TKZ were that these were not amazing wins.

Aldo 'GOAT' people rely on us not to actually consider how elite these wins were, but rather just to add them to the defence stat without thinking about it.

But they can't have it both ways. If the title defence stat is meaningful, then so of course is his horrible record against other champs and the horrible record of his competition vs these other champs. Aldo's record against his very best competition is frankly embarrassing.

Both Volk and Max are ahead of Aldo in FW GOAT talk. Aldo's fanboys are miserable fools. No GOAT gets humiliated in 13 secs. Also Aldo almost got finished by Hominick (a nobody) in the 5th round

 

[MDoza]

This will be even funnier when he loses.

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