Official Coaches and Trainers Discussion

[Sinister]

the money side of things is just as important. God knows fighters don’t have money, so you’ve got to be able to make it somewhere else so you can invest your time and energy into them.

I’ll shoot you a dm so we can touch base and then I’ll see about sorting out a solid plan B to get all of us to communicate

If I get what I want from the NVSAC, it'll change how we make money. It's strange that I have to go and argue to a governing body that trainers should have more say in our destinies and actually get paid for the work we do as opposed to hoping someday we find a goose that lays golden eggs and that that goose doesn't fire us.

 

[DoctorTaco]

If I get what I want from the NVSAC, it'll change how we make money. It's strange that I have to go and argue to a governing body that trainers should have more say in our destinies and actually get paid for the work we do as opposed to hoping someday we find a goose that pays golden eggs and that that's goose doesn't fire us.

im interested in hearing more about this because you’re absolutely right. I’m starting to make more than I did when I had a day job, but it sure as hell isnt from fighters.

 

[Sinister]

im interested in hearing more about this because you’re absolutely right. I’m starting to make more than I did when I had a day job, but it sure as hell isnt from fighters.

I don't want to divulge the full details publicly, but let's just say I've been studying a lot of things like this:



Do you know how many people have asked me for a "free trial week"...? Or day? As if you could learn anything about how to box in a day. I do lessons for visitors sometimes that's only a day, but that shit sure isn't free. In fact it's the most expensive way to learn from me. Also how many times I've been compared to other people/places. "Well so and so only charged me ____." Yes and you're here because it sucked, you just told me that. I have kids, they need to eat.

 

[Sinister]

This one is really good, too. One time I had a kid I trained for a long time pitch a hissy-fit over me FINALLY requiring he pay me. Before he handed me the money, which was LESS than my monthly price for anyone else, he made a comment about me needing to do more since I'm being paid. He had told me two days before that he wanted to do solely conditioning for 2 weeks, I said: "What you want me to towel you off? Clap when you're finished?" He tried to stick by his guns then I said: "Okay, so tell me. What conditioning are you going to do? What exercises?" He kinda blushed and looked down and said "our normal ones." I said: "Okay, how about it's $2 an exercise you're going to use that's MINE or go fuck yourself and find your own." He shut up...



The changes I want to make in the business of boxing will add more structure so that we don't always have to behave in this manner as free-lancers. Constantly being desperate for clientele, or otherwise being subject to salary caps because all of our clients are supplied by the gym we work for. We'll be able to build our own brand, and capitalize on it without selling our fighters' blood. Which will also weed out the fakers. They won't be able to build shit and everyone will know it.

 

[Cheap Shot]

Like my brother who already posted in this thread, I share the same experience.

- 15 years as a USA Boxing coach.
- Successfully built and sold a boxing club. For 5 years acted as owner (member managed LLC, 4 members), boxing coach, and book keeper for the business.
- Built new successful gym with brother last October. Have expanded from 3,500 square feet to now over 7,500 square feet. Gym currently contains 31 heavy bags, ring, and various high end circuit training equipment (rowers, air bikes, etc.).
- Have no debt, loan or credit, on the gym. Monthly expenses roughly $6,000.
- Work with many amateur boxers and one professional MMA fighter who is a veteran of many major organizations.

Aside from my lengthy experience as a USA Boxing coach in a competitive region, something I bring to the table that others don't is that I've successfully built two businesses from the ground up in the sport of boxing. There are serious jumps in accountability when you move from coach to owner. I'm the one writing the checks out of my bank account, and if things go south, it's not as though I can just pack up and work at another gym based on my abilities as a coach.

It's a completely different game when you sign that lease, and I can certainly share my experiences on how to stay profitable while also being able to build a stable of fighters.

 

[beaglepuss]

I found the key to (financial) success in the business of boxing is this distinction: The sport is why I own a boxing club, but it's not how I own boxing club.

Want to supplement your income without cheapening your brand? Tip number one: Partner with college athletic teams!

My gym is directly located between two major universities, and one of my instructors just happens to be involved in the athletic department of one of those universities. As a result, we've trained the following teams: Football, Men's Soccer, Women's Soccer, Men/Women's Swim and Dive Team, Women's Lacrosse, Field Hockey, Softball, and Golf. We're currently lined up to train the Sail Team and Dance Team. This is all in an 11 month span mind you.

With Football, we trained 75 players four times in the month. It's a well-respected program that brought additional income to the gym (we charge $10 a head for private groups with $100 minimum), introduced 75 athletes to our facility, and made for a fantastic social media opportunity. We have 75 members of the team pose for pics and then tag the gym in their post. That brings a HUGE number of new eyes to the gym. From there, I'm able to use the post as a resume of sorts when I go to approach the other university in the area. I can show their athletic director that I trained X number of teams, and show what I can do for their programs.
Next Tip: Other gym owners are dumber than you; capitalize on their failures!

 

[DoctorTaco]

Like my brother who already posted in this thread, I share the same experience.

- 15 years as a USA Boxing coach.
- Successfully built and sold a boxing club. For 5 years acted as owner (member managed LLC, 4 members), boxing coach, and book keeper for the business.
- Built new successful gym with brother last October. Have expanded from 3,500 square feet to now over 7,500 square feet. Gym currently contains 31 heavy bags, ring, and various high end circuit training equipment (rowers, air bikes, etc.).
- Have no debt, loan or credit, on the gym. Monthly expenses roughly $6,000.
- Work with many amateur boxers and one professional MMA fighter who is a veteran of many major organizations.

Aside from my lengthy experience as a USA Boxing coach in a competitive region, something I bring to the table that others don't is that I've successfully built two businesses from the ground up in the sport of boxing. There are serious jumps in accountability when you move from coach to owner. I'm the one writing the checks out of my bank account, and if things go south, it's not as though I can just pack up and work at another gym based on my abilities as a coach.

It's a completely different game when you sign that lease, and I can certainly share my experiences on how to stay profitable while also being able to build a stable of fighters.

dm sent

 

[beaglepuss]

dm sent

Cheapshot is my brother/business partner for what it's worth. He and I share the same experience in the industry, but have different roles within the business.

Mark (Cheapshot) is our numbers and logistics guy. He takes care of the bills, insurance, bookkeeping, taxes, registration (USA Boxing, LLC...), ordering, margins, hiring/scheduling/firing trainers, etc. He's extremely knowledgeable when it comes to the ins and outs of running a gym. From inception to fruition, Mark has done it all when it comes to running a successful boxing club. He also does a mean amateur wrap.

I'm the mouthpiece and marketing/networking guy. I make sure our boxers are competing, our social media is engaging, our classes are full, and our clients are excited to spend money at our gym.

We both take on the head coaching role when it comes to competitive boxing. All decisions come from us and trickle down when it comes to fights.

 

[DoctorTaco]

I don't want to divulge the full details publicly, but let's just say I've been studying a lot of things like this:



Do you know how many people have asked me for a "free trial week"...? Or day? As if you could learn anything about how to box in a day. I do lessons for visitors sometimes that's only a day, but that shit sure isn't free. In fact it's the most expensive way to learn from me. Also how many times I've been compared to other people/places. "Well so and so only charged me ____." Yes and you're here because it sucked, you just told me that. I have kids, they need to eat.

I do free consultations with potential clients. We talk about their what their life is like now, what they want it to be like, and how they see boxing fitting into that equation. I spend an hour going over the basics of footwork and stance and how to throw a jab, cross,
And hook. We finish with a work out on the mitts which using my cardio/fitness system gets them throwing combinations and responding to non verbal ques pretty quick. As long as they know my prices before we start (60/hour, 4 lessons for 200, 8 for 350) then my conversion rate from consult to client is pretty high.

This one is really good, too. One time I had a kid I trained for a long time pitch a hissy-fit over me FINALLY requiring he pay me. Before he handed me the money, which was LESS than my monthly price for anyone else, he made a comment about me needing to do more since I'm being paid. He had told me two days before that he wanted to do solely conditioning for 2 weeks, I said: "What you want me to towel you off? Clap when you're finished?" He tried to stick by his guns then I said: "Okay, so tell me. What conditioning are you going to do? What exercises?" He kinda blushed and looked down and said "our normal ones." I said: "Okay, how about it's $2 an exercise you're going to use that's MINE or go fuck yourself and find your own." He shut up...



The changes I want to make in the business of boxing will add more structure so that we don't always have to behave in this manner as free-lancers. Constantly being desperate for clientele, or otherwise being subject to salary caps because all of our clients are supplied by the gym we work for. We'll be able to build our own brand, and capitalize on it without selling our fighters' blood. Which will also weed out the fakers. They won't be able to build shit and everyone will know it.

its always the talented ones that expect the most freebies. They are the hot chick who can’t believe you won’t buy them another drink at the bar.

I have one active pro athlete and another who’s going to be active soon (he speaks French and veeeery little English, but that’s another thread) and I’m going to be following the model from a few well known coaches I respect and NOT take my cut from them. This way they are my employee, not the other way around. There’s no trying to collect from a guy after he lost his 3rd fight in a row, there’s no chance I can be accused of reccomending a match up or turning one down because of money, and there’s no opportunity for a guy to make demands of my time or what we do with it because he just cut me a 10% check for thousands of dollars.

But this only works if I can continue to make money hustling fitness and white collar clients

 

[Sano]

I found the key to (financial) success in the business of boxing is this distinction: The sport is why I own a boxing club, but it's not how I own boxing club.

Want to supplement your income without cheapening your brand? Tip number one: Partner with college athletic teams!

My gym is directly located between two major universities, and one of my instructors just happens to be involved in the athletic department of one of those universities. As a result, we've trained the following teams: Football, Men's Soccer, Women's Soccer, Men/Women's Swim and Dive Team, Women's Lacrosse, Field Hockey, Softball, and Golf. We're currently lined up to train the Sail Team and Dance Team. This is all in an 11 month span mind you.

With Football, we trained 75 players four times in the month. It's a well-respected program that brought additional income to the gym (we charge $10 a head for private groups with $100 minimum), introduced 75 athletes to our facility, and made for a fantastic social media opportunity. We have 75 members of the team pose for pics and then tag the gym in their post. That brings a HUGE number of new eyes to the gym. From there, I'm able to use the post as a resume of sorts when I go to approach the other university in the area. I can show their athletic director that I trained X number of teams, and show what I can do for their programs.View attachment 441097
Next Tip: Other gym owners are dumber than you; capitalize on their failures!

Very smart branching out like that. I've thought about something simular in regards to athletics and S&C.

 

[DoctorTaco]

@Cheap Shot @beaglepuss plane is lifting off now, flying back to pdx after a tournament in San Jose. Will hit you guys up later. Thank you for being willing to partake in these talks

 

[DoctorTaco]

Very smart branching out like that. I've thought about something simular in regards to athletics and S&C.

I’ve got a bud in Norway who does this for a hockey team. Been very good for him

 

[Sano]

I’ve got a bud in Norway who does this for a hockey team. Been very good for him

Nice. I just got a contract with a very serious "fitness" gym with a lot of equipment geared towards S&C and fighting, but It's as a private entity so it's entirely my own responsibility to build my brand and get clients. It's hard to know exactly how much I want to invest in this because as much as I LOVE S&C and (fight)sports, as a physio I want to devote some of my time to help the disenfranchised and hurt/sick. It's very rewarding, but it doesn't pay the bills in quite the same way. If I could do both, that would be perfect. Anyway, that's besides the point.

I've been thinking about branching out and contacting sports teams who may not have a solid foundation of S&C coaches and physios at this point. Sounds like a very good idea. Potential customers, increased brand recognition, gaining experience, so on.

 

[beaglepuss]

I've been thinking about branching out and contacting sports teams who may not have a solid foundation of S&C coaches and physios at this point. Sounds like a very good idea. Potential customers, increased brand recognition, gaining experience, so on.

I know "free" is a four letter word in this industry, but pro-bono classes are a great way to build a client base. With a service-based business you're not discounting a product, just your time. Consider it a loss-leader, much like Groupon and such. Just be smart about who you're training for "free."

Now, have an existing brand and social media account ready to go. Consider bartering with the group. One free group class in exchange for some publicity via social media. Remember, nothing is truly free. Make sure your seeing a return in exchange for you time. When you post on your Insta/Facebook, tag like a maniac. Tag the athletes, your facility, the team that you trained, the university that they're a part of, the city you're located, the city they're located, etc. The more eyes, the better.

It will showcase your training, expose you to potential new clients, and build your resume. You then contact other programs and let them know what you already offer by showing them the proof of concept. From there, things will (hopefully) snowball.

 

[Sano]

I know "free" is a four letter word in this industry, but pro-bono classes are a great way to build a client base. With a service-based business you're not discounting a product, just your time. Consider it a loss-leader, much like Groupon and such. Just be smart about who you're training for "free."

Now, have an existing brand and social media account ready to go. Consider bartering with the group. One free group class in exchange for some publicity via social media. Remember, nothing is truly free. Make sure your seeing a return in exchange for you time. When you post on your Insta/Facebook, tag like a maniac. Tag the athletes, your facility, the team that you trained, the university that they're a part of, the city you're located, the city they're located, etc. The more eyes, the better.

It will showcase your training, expose you to potential new clients, and build your resume. You then contact other programs and let them know what you already offer by showing them the proof of concept. From there, things will (hopefully) snowball.

Yeah I had something simular in mind, thanks a lot. The PR part is a bit against my nature but I know it's an essential part of "building a brand", and I think it can still be done tastefully.

 

[beaglepuss]

Yeah I had something simular in mind, thanks a lot. The PR part is a bit against my nature but I know it's an essential part of "building a brand", and I think it can still be done tastefully.

I totally understand where you're coming from. Remember though, you can market and build a brand without being a bullshit artist. If you're good at what you do, and you provide a great service, why not showcase it as much as possible?

If you're disingenuous, people will see right through it. Our old business partners would post daily, and it was always fluff. "Bring out the boxer within!" "You either win, or get better!" "Monday's be like..." Shit like that. They've got a million followers on social media, but very few post likes. Why? Because people know that it's all pillow talk. There's no substance there. They post for the sake of posting, and that it.

Our post are never about us. It's always about our members. Sports teams, families that train together, young/aspiring boxers that are preparing or have won fights, etc. These are the type of post that resonate with people. They're genuine and people can relate to them. I truly like these people and am proud of their accomplishments, and people get behind that sort of thinking.

If you're legitimately passionate about what you do, people will flock to you. You can't impress people if they don't know you exist.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Yeah I had something simular in mind, thanks a lot. The PR part is a bit against my nature but I know it's an essential part of "building a brand", and I think it can still be done tastefully.

you've got to find your voice on social media. personally, I farm out a lot of my social media work. I take the photos and upload them to a google drive that a professional photographer/business manager then edits and posts for me. (we have a trade deal worked out: boxing lessons for social media services) all I have to do is have matching captions for her in a different file. I HATE social media, it's the worst part of my job (which tells you how great my job is) but it is part of the gig these days.

forget about authentic. it's a hack buzz word these days. youre not trying to be authentic, you're trying to be transparent. if you swear as a coach, swear in your social media. (tastefully). if you hate mitt work, mention it when you post clips of you working drills or bag exercises with your clients, fighters, etc. there's room to be yourself and be succcessful.

granted, i only have about 800 followers on IG right now, but its growing steadily.

 

[Sano]

Thanks @beaglepuss and @DoctorTaco. Some very good advice.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Thanks @beaglepuss and @DoctorTaco. Some very good advice.

more and more I'm realizing I'm starting to get a handle on the business side of things which has lead me to work like hell to grow my knowledge and experience. my next step is to start traveling more to visit big name coaches and see how they run their programs, fight teams, and fighters. shadow them for a week at a time and help out however possible.

 

[Sinister]

more and more I'm realizing I'm starting to get a handle on the business side of things which has lead me to work like hell to grow my knowledge and experience. my next step is to start traveling more to visit big name coaches and see how they run their programs, fight teams, and fighters. shadow them for a week at a time and help out however possible.

If you ever want to do that internationally, I can help with that.